foam insulation

[EVADER09]

I just purchased a old old Kyosho Catamaran. The hull seems a little weak and I want to make sure it doesn't fall apart on me in wake. I was wondering if I can use a form of spray in foam insulation to put in the front. Would it work you guys think?

[xerox76]

I use spray foam on hand built boats,

word of advice,

keep in mind the expansion as it hits air to harden

[Doug Forrester]

Personally, I would not recommend using spray foam insulation anywhere in boat hulls. It never really stops expanding, especially when the boat gets heated up in the sun and can and will distort or even split open any hull that is filled with it. It will continue to expand in all directions, not necessarily just out any opening.

[EVADER09]

So your saying that it'll keep expanding and break my hull? I used it before in a actict (which get very hot) and it doesn't keep expanding. In fact a lot of building companys use spray in insulation to put in walls behind sheet rock (dry wall) and it doesn't seem to bulge out the walls or anything. I haven't used that method before but I might do it on a house soon. I don't see why it would do that, I think it would be fine. I came up with a little experement just in case though. I'm gunna spray it into a little container and put the lid on it, put it out in the sun and see if it bulges out the container or something. If it does I won't use it in my boat of course. How long do you guys think I should leave it in the container in the yard to see if it does? should I leave it out there for a day or two?

[Eric B]

Use low expanding foam if anything.

Eric

[Climate]

You can take Doug's advice or dismiss it. All I can tell you is I have met with Doug on several occasions, I have seen his boats, (they are second to none) and he knows how to build.
He knows what works, and what doesn’t!
I think his record of winning hull designs speak for themselves.

You can try the foam if you want. It’s your boat!

[T.S.Davis]

Another thing with the foam is if it gets wet it takes an eternity to dry out. I used Great Stuff to fill in some voids on my pontoon boat. I found that a week later the center of the void was still gooy. There is also no way you can compare the structural integrity of drywall to thin abs plastic. Hey there's an idea. A hull constructed of gyp. board. Not very fast but with 30 minute fire barrier rating to contain those pesky brushless esc fires. Bring on the foam!

Terry

[Doug Forrester]

Terry
ROTFLMAO - "Drywall without a Drydock"

[EVADER09]

I hope you guys understood the what I ment in that not saying cause it it holds in sheet rock that I'm going to use drywall for my boat or anything crazy like that, its the concept that I'v never seen it expand after its done drying and I don't think the brand I use would bulge the hull.

[T.S.Davis]

Sorry Hank. I didn't mean to have a chuckle at your expense.

The risk of the foam expanding to a point that it splits the hull was not just guess work. I've actually herd tale of exactly that happening. Same with the moisture problem. It gets wet and stays that way for ages and your boat becomes a barge. At least thats the story. The spray foam debate has been had on this forum more than once since I've been hangin around. Maybe the stuff you have will be different and you will have stumbled onto something new to share with the rest. That's how we find new things. Somebody blazes a path and tries something new. Pool noodles cut to fit work good and pipe insulation works great. The pipe insulation conforms to the hull as you push it up in there. Good luck with it which ever way you decide. Just don't forget to have fun.

Terry

[EVADER09]

Sorry for yapping at you, afterall you guys have more experience than I do. Thats a great idea to cut pool noodles to fit!! I might go with that for the sides all the way down cause nothing goes down there and use the pipe insulation to shove up in the front since I think it will be hard to cut the pool noodle to the right angles and such. thanks and sorry.

[T.S.Davis]

Hank,

I'm no expert! Still learnen too. Some of these guys really are experts. Keep hanging around and you'll figure who knows their stuff. I like the pipe insulation. Easier to work into tight spots but a pool noodle is $1.49 or something.

I see your from Michigan. Where abouts?

Terry

[EVADER09]

I'm from West Olive. which is Holland Zeeland area I go to Zeeland High School. West olive is just out in the country "redneck territory"!! YYYYEEEEEEEEEHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAA ask Eric B. he'll tell you. I live in the boon docks and am a "redneck" myself.

[Avenger]

i would try the paking air baloons! the are big holds lots of air and only 1-2 would float your entire boat! yeah west olive is definatly in the boonies!

[EVADER09]

I like it out in the boonies though, I got a quad to mess around anywhere and everywhere, a track for my trucks ( not used anymore just go on quad trail :D) and plenty of ponds to put these boats in when I'm all done. I'M FROM THE COUNTRY, I'M FROM THE COUNTRY AND I LIKE IT THAT WAY!!! Quote from a good' ol country song.

[T.S.Davis]

My family is from the Mountains of West Virginia. No rednecks in my family. Mostly hicks. Thers a difference. I have family in Grandville. Can't be too far from Zeeland/Holland area. Great beaches in holland area.

Later,
Terry

[EVADER09]

Yeah I love to go camping at Holland State Park and right down the road is the best beach in Holland, by the pier and brand spankin new board walk!! Yeah most of my relitaves live in the Grandville/ Jenison area which is around a half an hour drive the way my step dad drives lol bu taround and hour for msot people from Zeeland. I called myself a redneck because I didn't know if you guys knew what a "hick" was. I am a "hick at heart but mainly a redneck, ask eric B. about my family bon fires and reunions and such. lol

And with what we were talking about before, I basically meant pipe insultaion when I said spray insulation but anywho, what brand do you guys think would work? Last time I used that stuff was around three years ago when we built our house, I've never used it on other houses ( not my job).

[Avenger]

the holland state park has to be one of the best fresh water beaches ever! i am there every day (that i dont have to work or playing with boats!) as for insulation... i would actualy try the slide on pipe insulation (it is gray and has a slit in it so you can slide it over pipes) but it has a smaller diameter and might be able to cram up into a boat better than a pool noodle!

[EVADER09]

Yeah that stuff sucks, it doesn't take form to anything but its cyander shape. I'll use spray. Avenger Hollnad beach is ok but there are a lot better beach's in Michigan. Such as Wolf Lake, its not as choppy, cleaner, and more private. My uncle is a realitor and he bought a lot of lake front property on the lake and he has a cottage on the lake that I help built so he lets me stay up there whenever I want is so much better than Holland.

[T.S.Davis]

My dad's got a place on wolf lake in one of those cheesy trailer parks that is right on the lake. Nice lake! Fun to dollar ratio is very good in Baldwin. Just stay away from the law in Baldwin.

Terry

[Avenger]

i have a camp up on Lake Superior... like right on the lake we are the only cabin on that strech of beach for about a mile in either direction (the canadian govenmet owns all of it expet for the 2 acres that we had in our famliy since... well lets just say forever and a day! ) and it is right on a nice sandy beach and nothing beats going up there bringing our car right onto the beach and havin' a campfire... not to mention you dont see anyone else AT ALL! i like holland state park cuz of the girls!


well back to the subject... just use the foam in moderation!

[EVADER09]

LOL Yeah We got hunting land in Baldwin. There not to friendly of folks around them parts lol. Where are you located at? Maybe we can get together, you, Eric B. and me. Eric B. is a good friend of myne and lives about a mile away from me. Do you think the small scat cat is anygood? My Cataramaran is pretty junked up and me and Eric both kind of want one and was wondering if we should. Anyone have any opions on them?

[TomL]

Air balloons or those big air pillows you get in shipping boxes are good to use, but every one I've had eventually leaked all the air out.

Spray foam is nice because it really -fills- the area. Until it breaks the hull open. And if it gets wet, it takes forever to dry out.

My vote goes for blue or pink contruction foam, or pool noodles.

[Avenger]

yeah i like it alot esecialy with the set up that i am using! it is a speed machine! (cordite 20/4 8 cells and x632 but run times really suffer!) turns on a dime and airs out nicely! really stable too! but right now i dont have a whole lot of time to play with boats! to bussy! im am working 48hrs a week (thats the limit for a minor in michigan) and i cant really sink any money into my boats i need a new car!(dad refuses to help cuz he is paying insurence!) mine craped out a while back and well it is now in the "u-wrench-it" lot... once school starts and i have my new vehical yeah sure i would love to get together and mess around at a pond! i am about 1/2 mile from the state park! their is one pond that i wish that they would let us run our boats in... do u know the craigs crusers pond? i want to run in there! huge pond, no weeds, just big carp that u have to watch out for!!!! and now that i am going to be making that big ole' aluminum boat (48")i can run that beast! i think i'll try and find like 35cc motor or bigger!

[EVADER09]

Oh yeah avenger that would be so cool to run in there pond! Have to concince them. I found that the spray insulation that I'm gunna use it waterproof and minimum expanding. Its called GREAT STUFF, I used it before and am very happy with results. It should work out just so perfectly. The only thing I need to do now is get ahold of a guy to order my SPEED 700 motor, I'v been trying to get ahold of him forever but can never catch him. Then I got to find a cheap esc that'll handle the motor I'm thinking a r/c hydros one. Then I'll be ready to run and go convince Craig's Cruisers to let us run in there pond. Eric B. is almost done with his SH so I gotta get going on this and get myne running.

[Avenger]

use it in moderation!

i used to work at craigs crusers! (worst job ever!) it would be an awsome pont to run in! no waves very little wind (it is all sheltered mostly) but i know that u would never be able to convince them on that because the managers are D***s i got writen up just for fishing ther on my day off! Monster CARP (so fun to fight) decent Bass 18" and tons o blue-gill! maybe we should go fishing there before they open like 7:00 (they open at 9)

[EVADER09]

lol alright avenger. Sounds like a killer plan. All we have to do is go there on a Sunday afternoon to run our boats. That is if they arn't open on Sundays I don't remember. If there not open who's gunna be there to stop us!!! HEHE

[Avenger]

actualy they are open on sundays! 12pm-11pm

[EVADER09]

really? dang there getting to be a big operation. We'll have to go before noon or like 3 in the morning lol.

[T.S.Davis]

Boats or no boats, you left cost Michiganders better show for the Michigan Cup next year. Put it on the calender now, pool together, tell your bosses you've had it planned for a year. Even if you just do a day trip on Saturday you won't be sorry. Be there at 9:00am go home at 9:00pm. It can't be more than an hour drive for you guys.

Okay I'm done. Are you convinced?

Terry

[Avenger]

from where we are lansing is about 1.5 hrs to get o the west side of lansing... we are right on lake michigan!

[EVADER09]

For one thing I'm just getting into boats but, I know my trucks and cars. Just about every race you go to it costs money to enter. I don't even know where this place is. If you give me more details like how much it cost to enter, where it is at, rules, and all that good stuff all of us west michigangers will probably be more intrested in going. I just want to be prepared. The only boat I have is a old Cataramaran right now I probably couldn't even race that. Give us details PM about all this stuff or something.

[T.S.Davis]

Try this www.mmeu.com. Maps and cost and all that bs is there somewheres. Sorry, my post was intended to be just be a little healthy ribbing. You could always come and watch and check out hte pits. I guess Sharp park must be exactly in the middle between us. It takes me 1.5 hours to get there too. I'm right close to Lake St.Clair. I drove in the first day rented a room and stayed. You've got a long time to think about it.

Later guys,
terry

[Avenger]

well evader... you have a little under a year to get ready! hows the foam coming?

[EVADER09]

I didn't put it in yet waiting for motor to see exaclty where it'll be. i know where it'll be basically but u know. Plus this weekend I'm going camping so I'll probably do it sometime early next week cause I'm going camping next weekend to. So I'll probably do it Tuesday night so it can sit for a whole week. Its called GREAT STUFF. I never tested it before but they say its aterproof so that could be a good thing and its minimum expansion.

[Eric B]

Well I hope to getting my boats drive system this weekend (Now that I'm done with band camp) but I doubt it could ever compete with boats at that competition. Maybe I should put aside my other projects lined up after the SH (Hydromite which I have all the building materials for and I'm already looking at building a gasoline powered airboat) and look at getting a better peformer that I can compete with.

All of us West Michigan guys should get together at the pond some saturday.

[EVADER09]

Eric you posted that like a month ago and your still no tdone with it. Come on get that think done so we can get to the pool and test them and go to your grandpa's to run them.